The email headline caught my eye, “Can Social Networks Help You Sell?” This is the sort of come-on that is stoking the social networking craze. But, it’s also the cause of so much bad Internet behavior.
Here’s a little exercise you can do for yourself in LinkedIn.
LinkedIn’s “Discussions” accompany each LinkedIn “Group.” They are the equivalent of the general “Answers” section in LinkedIn, but you must be a member of that group to participate in those discussions. (We wrote more about the advantages and disadvantages of this kind of group “exclusivity” in “Run, Charlotte, Run.”)
A Real LinkedIn Discussion
Ready for the exercise? If you belong to any LinkedIn “Group,” simply go to the “Discussions” tab for that group.
Next, compare the number of comments that real questions get vs. the zeros that are racked up by the sales pitchers.
In the picture above, Nanette Littlestone asked a real question to get a real discussion going in the Book Publishing Professionals group. She asked, “What are the most important things writers look for in an editor?”
Right away, in no time at all, the comments started to roll in. Soon there were 36. These were real people responding to her question and trying to help her make the right decision.
By the way, if you go to this discussion (if you belong to the group), you’ll notice that Nanette also publicly thanked and commented back to every single one of the folks who took the time to answer. That’s what networking is about – it’s about the conversation, and conversations build relationships.
A Fake LinkedIn Discussion
Compare that with the picture below, where someone blared, “Check out my profile.” Here’s the thing, though. NO ONE responded. It didn’t work. Even after a month, no one responded.
Why? Because it’s not the place. It’s no more appropriate here than it would have been at a real-life networking event. At such an event, this guy wouldn’t have just handed you his card and said, “Buy my stuff.” But, he does exactly that here!
Why didn’t he get any comments? Everyone knew that he was simply promoting himself – or his seminar, or his life-enhancing elixir. They moved away from him, just as they would from that kind of bad behavior in real life.
The Internet is no different from real life, but we’re being sold on the idea that it is. We’re being sold that online social networks can help us sell, and we’re being told we can do it in an anti-social way.
Go for Brooke
The great thing about this exercise is that you can replicate it over and over, and you’ll always get the same results. Selling and self promotion do not work here.
In fact, selling and spamming have become so common and so unacceptable that some savvy groups, like Brian Carroll’s B2B Lead Generation Roundtable, have decided to try and stop it.
Brooke Bower moderates Carroll’s B2B group and she recently posted this warning to its members:
Blatant self promotion, job postings, spam or topics not related to B2B lead generation will be removed. If you post off topic again, you will be removed from the group.
Good for you, Brooke. Let’s keep the discussions in “Discussions” and move the anti-social behavior somewhere else.
15 comments ↓
Thanks so much, Michael, for the “discussion” and the wonderful article. I greatly appreciate you taking the time and effort. It just so happens that was my first experience leading a discussion on LinkedIn and I was both surprised and amazed at the helpful responses. As a result of the discussion, I’ve had off-site conversations with Hilary Powers (another editor) and Miriam Pia (writer) and recommended Carol White (marketing consultant) to an author friend. Not to mention all the wonderful articles and advice I’ve found on Golden Compass.
Thanks again, Michael, for your generosity.
I’m curious, I think the thanking of each response is also going a bit far. I think the repsonse has to be more than a thank you. It needs to be a meaningful comment. Othersie the conversation just ends. The problem I have is whether each answer should be responded to privately as opposed to publicly. When do you feel the private versus public should be done?
Great post! I agree, we need to remember that social media and business networking tools like LinkedIn are about supporting connections and building relationships. To start a start or build any relationship requires a conversation.
I think you captured that point well. I think the best way to “sell” online is to be a relevant resource, share your expertise and genuinely seek to help others in the community/group. If you do it right you don’t have to “sell” people start coming to you.
Hi Nanette and Guy,
Guy, I’ll let Nanette’s responses speak for your questions, Guy. Yes, she comments and extends the conversation with her responses. Not sure I’ve seen it done better than the way Nanette does it.
The thing is “it’s about the conversation – and conversations build relationships.”
Hi Nanette and Guy again,
Sorry I was rushed when I responded before. Guy, I do think that replying in private is sometimes called for, but the point of doing things in public is to get the conversation going. It’s no different from blog comments. Ideally, comments on the blog are back and forth and continuous. That’s the power.
Nanette, your stories about creating relationships with folks are just great. Thanks for being such a good example.
Very few people would attend a networking event, go up to somebody and say, “Hi, I’m Joe. I fix computers. If you ever need your computer fixed, here, call me,” and thrust a business card in their face before going on to the next person. (Although some people, surprisingly, would.)
How do they get more business at such an event? By becoming a trusted member of the community (president of the Chamber of Commerce, volunteer on numerous committees, showing up at all of the meetings, etc.).
Yet many people think that this same kind of one-shot, boorish behavior on LinkedIn is perfectly okay. (Maybe because they attended a Webinar that told them this was the way to utilize the new media.)
My favorite quote on this subject comes from Seth Godin, author of the best-selling marketing book Purple Cow.
In the March 2009 issue of Success magazine, Godin says:
“You never heard me say you had to be on Facebook and you had to be on Twitter. I don’t think you do. If you are going to go there, you had better go for the right reasons. And if your reason is to sell more stuff, please don’t bother. It’s not going to work. People don’t care about you. They just don’t.
If, on the other hand, your goal is to connect with real people as a person, then by all means go . . . Every time I see a real estate broker or . . . someone who wants me to pay money to a seminar, I cringe. We all cringe.
It’s like someone going to a funeral or a cocktail party trying to sell mutual funds. We don’t want that to happen.
And if you are using these media as ways to do business the way you used to do business [marketers are spammers . . . they think the new media is just like television, but it's free], you will fail.
You will be embarrassed as you do it. And you will waste your time. [You will blather on about yourself and no one will listen.]
On the other hand, if you can use them as ways to connect to real people, just for that sake alone, not because you want to sell anything, then it’s a great way to spend a half hour a day.
And what we are finding, as a by-product of that . . . yes, in fact, your business will do better, because you are a trusted member of the community. Not because you are trying to sell stuff.”
Thank you very much for this helpful discussion and the examples that you’ve included.
I’ve just recently started utilizing social media tools for learning and professional opportunities and must confess, I’m probably guilty of some web etiquette violations. However, more likely due to lack of experience in proper use of the tools available.
With your explanation, I will now be better equipped to use social media to help myself and others.
Melanie Morris, MaguireZay Lead Generation, mmorris@maguirezay.com
Hi Brian and Ted,
You both make so many good points about social networking we should send you out across the Internet to teach social networking. Brian could teach “supporting connections and building relationships” and Ted could teach, well, Seth Godin. There’s a reason the first three letters of Seth’s last name are….
Who is teaching the classes that tell folks to just log on and have a one-way conversation? They are the folks who are selling their own stuff in a one-way conversation! And, because it’s new, and because it’s the Internet, people are willing to shell out for their nonsense.
As we’ve pointed out before – there is NO reason to pay anyone to learn how to use these tools. That’s exactly what these social networks are for – tons of folks willing to help you get the hang of them.
Besides that, your mother already taught you everything you need to know about social networks – be respectful, lend a hand, answer when you’re spoken to, say “please,” and, for heavens sake, say “thank you.”
Thank you, guys.
Hi Melanie,
You have a very good point that many of the folks who are such good examples of anti-social social networking just don’t know any better. And, that’s just why we think that more LinkedIn Groups need to monitor the “Discussion” areas of their groups the way Brooke and Brian are.
Since you say you are new, I’ll leave the link you inserted into your comment. People can see who you are by clicking on your name. There is no need to insert another link to your blog. Many blog spam blockers throw out such comments, so don’t do it.
Thanks for your comment – and keep learning. We’re all learning these new resources and tools, so don’t let anyone get on your case too much.
Michael,
It’s been a while since I visited your page, and as before, I am so glad I paid another visit! Although I have worked in my field for over 6 years, I only just went solo this year. So, networking and sales are all so very new to me. As with Melanie, I have made some mistakes, started Tweeting with the wrong people, and there are many people sitting waiting to bring you down and point you out.
However, thankfully, there are also people like yourself who will educate and inform you in a kind, and genuine way, and for one reason, to help you learn and grow.
All the best
Megan
Hi Megan,
I always love your messages almost more than any others – and not just because you’re a friend of Darla Dixon’s. I like that you randomly return to our blog. We don’t send out email newsletters or blasts because we think that readers these days can opt to receive what they want via email or Google Desktop or RSS. But, we love that you return every once in a while – and even more that you take the time to write. We also love your honesty. We all make mistakes and if someone tells you they have the official rules for social networking, just tell them they must be smoking something.
Thanks for returning and for taking the time.
Thanks for the thoughtful discussion on an important topic, as you do so often.
I rarely check Twitter, Facebook and other listserves to which I belong because there is so much self-promotional noise. People just don’t get how off-putting it is. It’s like the spammers — they get an occasional sale so they think it works, not realizing how many people they repel in the process of shouting from the mountaintops to “buy my stuff” or “look at how great I am.” Blech!
And I think thanking people in a discussion stream w/out furthering the conversation is just noise. Thank them privately if you have nothing more to add. I do it on my blogs and it keeps the comments worth reading and the commenters coming back.
Hi Rebecca,
I almost don’t dare to thank you on here – but I will anyway. I think thanks are due and I think a comment to continue the discussion is due, also. I hear so many people say that they just don’t use the social networking tools, like you, because of the “self-promotional noise.” Such an accurate phrase. If we weren’t involved in looking at how the Internet works – what works and what doesn’t – I would have left many of these so-called resources behind some time ago.
I still think they have value -and I still agree with my very astute and insightful speaking partner, Sheryl Kay. She says, it’s like we live next to a beautiful park, with waterfalls and places for the kids to play. Now, the park is being invaded by pimps and pushers. Is it our responsibility to help keep it clean. You bet it is. Who else will do it.
So, I’ll thank you in the stream and invite you back again.
Thanks Rebecca – few are doing the good work you are doing at SpeakerNetNews.com.
Please visit my site for my thoughts on a subject tangentially related to this: Just kidding.
Another great post calling out shenanigans in the world of online communication.
Great post, same as the others I’ve read already.
I’m one of the Group Managers on “Linked.Net” and we take a very dim view on there with Spam posts.
Many are spotted and deleted within 30 minutes or so, and in a lot of cases with the more prolific ones, we simply remove and remove and block the Member, no warnings no arguments.
One growing trend I have noticed however, is people posting messages such as:
[Question here]
We are currently running a poll on this …
[Link]Please click here to register your views[/link]
Where the link is very often passed through a shortening service such as “bit.ly” so you can’t tell what it is before you click on it.
What I’ve found is a really good way to deal with these, is to actually answer the question in the discussion post itself. In quite a few cases, the original poster has either withdrawn there post(s) or left the group of their own will, never to return.
Those that do stay, usually don’t post again. Quite why this works I don’t know, but I suspect it has somthing to do with the return count of post notifications.
Beacuse each reply results in an E-Mail to the original poster, and beacuse you need to use an active email address to open the account, then I suspect that by doing this, I (and others joining the discussion) are generating return spam to the poster, that they don’t want, I could be wrong however.
This is just one of my observations, as I go about my Zero Tolerance on Spam, but it does seem to have some impact, maybe the future way to combat the menace is to fight them on their own turf using their own methods.
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